Linguistic Related

"A Modest Proposal" (No, not that one) · Linguistic Related

Q I

How can linguists tell which languages are related to each other, and how distantly?
https://www.quora.com/How-can-linguists-tell-which-languages-are-related-to-each-other-and-how-distantly/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-1

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

14.VII.2025

It’s not always that they can, if “related” means “descend from common parents language”.

When it comes to languages as closely related as Dutch and English or Spanish and French, there is basically no doubt they are related (or, if Germanic languages descend from more than one parents language, all descend from both or all, not one from one and other from other with mutual influences).

Similarily Finnish and Sapmi, Turkish and Azeri and so on …

But when it comes to saying Germanic and Romance both (supposedly) descend from Proto-Indo-European, I find that as uncertain as saying Finnish and Turkish both descend from Proto-Altaic. Hint: an Altaic unity has been proposed, pretty accepted, and then rejected.

As unsure as it would be if one proposed Altaic, Indo-European, Eskimo-Aleutic all descended from Nostratic, which some do.

If all examples of languages having both differences and similarities and the similarities well beyond pure coincidence were just explained by the languages starting identic and drifting apart, fine, if so one could certainly make a case for knowing “German is more related to Dutch than to French, more to French than to Finnish, more to Finnish (possibly even) than to Greenlandic Eskimo” … but the problem is, another process can also explain it, they start out unrelated, they then are spoken in areas with lots of bilingual speakers and so both words and systematic features are mutually borrowed.

One of the cases for Altaic was vowel harmony. Here is current wikipedia[1] on that vowel harmony:

There are some proposed sound correspondences for Tungusic languages. For example, Norman (1977) supports a Proto-Tungusic *t > Manchu s when followed by *j in the same stem, with any exceptions arising from loanwords. Some linguists believe there are connections between the vowel harmony of Proto-Tungusic and some of the neighboring non-Tungusic languages. For example, there are proposals for an areal or genetic correspondence between the vowel harmonies of Proto-Korean, Proto-Mongolian, and Proto-Tungusic based on an original RTR harmony. This is one of several competing proposals, and on the other hand, some reconstruct Proto-Tungusic without RTR harmony.

Obviously, “areal” means, they borrowed this feature from each other, “genetic” means a reference to common parent language. In other words, linguists don’t know, it could have happened either way. If the differences are bigger than the similarities, areal features may take less time, if they are on the other hand smaller than the similarities (as with German and Dutch) a common parent language takes less time.

A Creationist and an Evolutionist will disagree on which explanation for Nostratic language similarities is the better one. So, if Nostratic is genetic, Proto-Nostratic was spoken “If the Nostratic hypothesis is true, then Proto-Nostratic was most likely spoken between 15,000 and 12,000 BCE.”[2] Now, as a Creationist, I don’t believe that date even existed. The carbon dates would correspond[3] to actual dates, in my own somewhat amateur table:

2699 BC (!)
20.835 pmC, dated as 15,666 BC

2691 BC
Eber born

2686 BC
24.08 pmC, dated as 14,456 BC
…
2660 BC
30.555 pmC, dated as 12,461 BC

2647 BC
33.784 pmC, dated as 11,618 BC

So, obviously, for Nostratic similarities, I prefer areal features. I make a similar point about Indo-European and Altaic.

Footnotes

[1] Tungusic languages - Wikipedia
[2] https://study.com/academy/lesson/nostratic-language-family-history-research-reconstruction.html
[3] Newer Tables, Flood to Joseph in Egypt

Q II

Is Italy as simple a language as English?
https://www.quora.com/Is-Italy-as-simple-a-language-as-English/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-1

Answer requested by

Md.Shakhawath Hossan

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

9.VII.2025

Probably a bit simpler overall.

• simpler spelling
• fewer tenses (English has sixteen)
• simpler declinsion (Italian only has plurals, positions, prepositions).

On the more complexities for Italian side:

• more Italian tenses are simple and therefore sometimes irregular
• the declinsion of Italian pronouns is less simple.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

14.VII.2025

Italian, not Italy, by the way. Italy is the country.

Q III

How do we know that Classical Latin had nasal vowels? For example, how do we know that "monstrum" was pronounced [ˈmõː.strũː] as Wiktionary suggests and not [ˈmon.strum] in c.100 BC-100 AD? Have French and Portuguese retained nasal vowels from Latin?
https://www.quora.com/How-do-we-know-that-Classical-Latin-had-nasal-vowels-For-example-how-do-we-know-that-monstrum-was-pronounced-%CB%88m%C3%B5%CB%90-str%C5%A9%CB%90-as-Wiktionary-suggests-and-not-%CB%88mon-strum-in-c-100-BC-100-AD-Have/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-1

Answer requested by

Dan Kost

Hans-Georg Lundahl

none/ apprx Masters in Latin (language) & Greek (language), Lund University

14.VII.2025

Latin lost nasal vowels and French and Portuguese got new ones.

How we know? Like we know French and Portuguese have them now. For how the language was pronounced, we don’t just have the spelling, we also have grammarians describing it.

Q IV

How many words do I need to create a language? I have the structure, I just need to build my vocabulary.
https://www.quora.com/How-many-words-do-I-need-to-create-a-language-I-have-the-structure-I-just-need-to-build-my-vocabulary/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-1

Answer requested by

Aileana Rose

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

11.VII.2025

What do you want the language FOR?

If you want to replace Esperanto, you need pretty many words.

If you want to write a few poems by imagined populations, you need about as many words as there are in the poems. Consequently, not surprisingly, Quenya actually has fewer words than Esperanto. Shocking, I know, but that’s the fact.

Q V

How do linguists use historical reconstruction to determine if a language was originally ergative or accusative, especially when written records are scarce?
https://www.quora.com/How-do-linguists-use-historical-reconstruction-to-determine-if-a-language-was-originally-ergative-or-accusative-especially-when-written-records-are-scarce/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-2

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

8.VI.2025

If all daughter languages are consistently accusative, one presumes the parent language was accusative, if they are ergative, ergative.

If the languages differ, or if there are inconsistencies about accusative / ergative within a language, linguists would probably argue both hypotheses, one arguing one, another arguing the other.

I think the linguists who argue ergative for original PIE do so because of traits they don’t find totally consistent with fully accusative type, in some of the daughter languages.

Q VI

How do constructed languages (like Esperanto) handle agglutination, and do they draw any inspiration from Indo-European examples?
https://www.quora.com/How-do-constructed-languages-like-Esperanto-handle-agglutination-and-do-they-draw-any-inspiration-from-Indo-European-examples/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-2

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

13.VI.2025

Constructed languages are not one family, there are many differences between Esperanto and Quenya, and also between them and Proto-Indo-European.

It depends who is constructing, what he is constructing it for (Esperanto as auxiliary language, Quenya as art language, PIE as linguistically reconstructed language) and (apart from the last category) personal choices.

So, the short answer is “in different ways” and the question is, by the term “constructed languages” so broadly asked, I cannot give a longer or more exhaustive answer.

Q VII

Is it possible to reach b2 level bulgarian in 1 year?
https://www.quora.com/Is-it-possible-to-reach-b2-level-bulgarian-in-1-year/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-2

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

10.VII.2025

1. Depends on your native language or previous good level foreign languages. Is it or one of them Slavic? If so, probably yes.
2. Also depends on your learning routine. If you immerse yourself in Bulgarian several hours a day for one year, without skipping a day and without skipping the grammar, probably yes or at least B1, even if you don’t speak any Slavic language prior to Bulgarian.

Q VIII

How significant were the Silk roads in mixing cultures and languages between Mesopotamia and Asia? Could this explain linguistic similarities?
https://www.quora.com/How-significant-were-the-Silk-roads-in-mixing-cultures-and-languages-between-Mesopotamia-and-Asia-Could-this-explain-linguistic-similarities/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-2

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Studied Latin (language) at Lund University

10.VII.2025

Oh, on the last question, maybe could. Obviously depends on how long it has been at work for.

Speaking of that, did you know that European branches of Indo-European had a cross road from the Mediterranean to Denmark in 1400–1200 BC. Maybe also could explain a few similarities now put down to common heritage from PIE.

On the first question, I don’t know much on the subject, but I would say very important. Just my spontaneous hunch from half remembered items of information and things.

Q IX

How do people balance the cultural importance of regional languages with the practical difficulties of learning them?
https://www.quora.com/How-do-people-balance-the-cultural-importance-of-regional-languages-with-the-practical-difficulties-of-learning-them/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-2

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

10.VII.2025

1. What people? Locals already know them.
2. For non-locals, that’s up to their taste!

Q X

Why do people say Finnish is more complex than French? What makes Finnish grammar so challenging compared to other European languages?
https://www.quora.com/Why-do-people-say-Finnish-is-more-complex-than-French-What-makes-Finnish-grammar-so-challenging-compared-to-other-European-languages/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-2

Hans-Georg Lundahl

amateur linguist

11.VII.2025

Totally depends on which language you start with.

Finnish has more noun cases than French. But French has more verb forms than Finnish.

Q XI

If English "tear" shares the same Indo-European root as Latin "lacrima" and Greek "dacryma", why is there no trace of the 'c' sound in the English word? Why is it not spelt "teighr", as Indo-European *k usually gives 'gh' in English (as in "eight")?
https://www.quora.com/If-English-tear-shares-the-same-Indo-European-root-as-Latin-lacrima-and-Greek-dacryma-why-is-there-no-trace-of-the-c-sound-in-the-English-word-Why-is-it-not-spelt-teighr-as-Indo-European-k-usually-gives-gh-in/answer/Hans-Georg-Lundahl-2

Answer requested by

Teo Samarzija

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Studied Latin (language) at Lund University

12.VII.2025

Whether or not “Indo-European” is the true origin of the word or not, pre-Germanic to Germanic gives k > χ, and then from there:

• χ > h word initially
• χ = ach-laut and χ > ich-laut in some other positions, spelled -gh (eight used to be pronounced eiçt)
• χ > disappears, and sooner in some positions (like before -r) than in others (eight lost the sound only later).

Pokorny states that 316. dak̂ru- occurs in Greek (from whence borrowed into Latin), in Celtic, both P and Q) and in Germanic. A similar word 50. ak̂ru occurs in Indo-Iranian, Lithuanian, Tocharian.