Accusers of the Church of Christ

On the post "Mariology" I had made this comment:

8:38 There are no 1260 years in the Bible anywhere. I mean, any stretch of years longer than that (like between Adam's creation and Abraham's birth) will contain several potential stretches this length.

But Apocalypse 12 is concerned with 1260 days.

The answer (whether rightly applied or not, I'm not denying it) would be with William Tapley, who considers this as meaning Mary is with the Church that flees into the wilderness.

She had no birthpangs in Bethlehem, but She kind of has when praying for the Church.

This led to the following debate:

peter zinya

Mary must really be in pain watching her catholic church get sued into the stone age because of all its pedophile priests. What is she doing about it beside standing there and crying.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@peter zinya Well, praying for the serpent to be defeated - you know the accuser and liar who's suing innocent along with guilty.

And She crushed his head with Her heel.

peter zinya

@Hans-Georg Lundahl And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

It shall bruise thy head, it is the seed of the woman, Jesus. When will you blasphemous catholics stop misquoting the bible? I guess the answer is never.

Catholic folk lore says Mary is all powerful and fights the devil. You say she fled from the devil and then she prays to defeat him. Well, catholicism is a false religion. Catholics are free to say whatever feels good. Catch as catch can, as long as you keep dropping dimes in the collection plate it doesnt matter what you think. Those priests always are in need of " get out of town " in a hurry money.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@peter zinya St. Jerome actually translates "she shall bruise thy head" ...

"Catholic folk lore says Mary is all powerful and fights the devil."

The angel said She had already won the battle against a major enemy of Israel, and since she had killed no human Holophernes or Sisera with Her hands, it means She had "killed" Satan or the old serpent.

This is what "blessed among women" means by allusion to OT events.

@peter zinya "Those priests always are in need of " get out of town " in a hurry money."

The late "Cardinal" Pell didn't get out of town in a hurry.

He faced the sham trial in which he was convicted for the word of two debauched and irresponsible people, one of which could not even be cross-examined, since he had already committed suicide.

peter zinya

@Hans-Georg Lundahl st jerome is a catholic shill. only catholics believe what he says. mary doesnt do any battle. the lord does battle for us. but if you have to have your powerful virgin queen of heaven, that is your choice.

@Hans-Georg Lundahl may i ask, who were these debauched people.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@peter zinya St. Jerome represents the common core of the Church of his time.

Calling him a "Catholic shill" simply means, you admit the Church back then was Catholic. Which according to Mt 28:16-20 means the Catholic Church is what Christ founded.

Just to be somewhat clear about detail ... possibly only Catholics believe what he said, but Orthodox and Lutherans and Anglicans at least pretend to honour him too. If only with their lips.

@peter zinya By the way, Copts and Armenians also honour him.

@peter zinya Two former altar boys.

One was a drug addict, and testified but retracted. One couldn't even testify, he had committed suicide when a friend "testified" on his behalf. On the retraction of the live "victim" Pell was exonerated, as he had hoped.

peter zinya

@Hans-Georg Lundahl I admit Jeerome was a shill for his religion. The born again have been here since pentacost. They dont have a organization or a flag or costumes. Christ is witnessed by word of mouth from person to person.
When i was first born again, i was led to others that this had happened to. We would meet in living rooms. The only topic was, wow i cant believe i was delivered from this or that religion or lifestyle or this or that philosophy. We gotta tell everyone we know and love, befor its too late.

@Hans-Georg Lundahl Pell lived with a raging pedophile for yrs, in the same house. Pell WAS a catholic priest. Thats enough evidence.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@peter zinya "I admit Jeerome was a shill for his religion."

Like you are for hatred of Catholicism ...

"The born again have been here since pentacost."

Jerome would have agreed. Born again by water and spirit in the sacrament of Baptism.

"They dont have a organization or a flag or costumes."

The Church in Jerusalem (Acts 2), the relation between Churches (Acts 8), the succession of some apostolic ministry we identify as episcopacy (Acts 7, Acts 13, I and II Timothy, Titus, Romans 10) sure look pretty much like an organisation to me.

"Christ is witnessed by word of mouth from person to person."

Acts 2 looks more like Speaker's corner in Hyde Park to me ...

"When i was first born again, i was led to others that this had happened to. We would meet in living rooms."

Sounds OK. When I got an extra baptism to make sure after (probably unfounded) doubts about my Lutheran baptism, by a Catholic priest, it was in a living room.

What I don't see is how this would be obligatory. If you mean they met in private houses, think of the fact one of these houses could hold 120 people (Acts 1). More villas than appartments.

"The only topic was, wow i cant believe i was delivered from this or that religion or lifestyle or this or that philosophy. We gotta tell everyone we know and love, befor its too late."

And somehow you weren't delivered from calumniating Catholics?

"Pell lived with a raging pedophile for yrs, in the same house."

Is he convicted, or is it hearsay?

"Pell WAS a catholic priest. Thats enough evidence."

The exact reason why I asked when you were going to get delivered from calumny ...

@peter zinya Citing wiki about Ridsdale:

"Cardinal George Pell, a former Archbishop of Melbourne, testified before the 1993 hearing that he and Ridsdale had shared a clergy house together while Pell was an assistant priest at St Alipius' Church with Ridsdale in the 1970s. Pell denied knowing about any of Ridsdale's absuse."

After what I read, I think Christian Brothers and Sr. Imelda are more of his accomplices in (real and convicted) crimes.

peter zinya

@Hans-Georg Lundahl By the way, Copts and Armenians also honor him.

Jerome must be a true man of god if all these unsaved religion people honor him. During the tribulation, most people will worship the Beast and his Image. Ive got $100 that says you will be one of them. Thats cause most people do it, you might as well do it. To bad i wont be here, even though id love to be here to watch and tell you guys......i told you so.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@peter zinya You know, the Church was in those days not persecuting heretics even marginally.

You pretend Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Copts (by the way, they were all one Church in St. Jerome's time) are "unsaved" ... whree do you find the "saved" for that time?

I am not asking about hierarchy, as you don't believe that, I am asking about visible presence, as a community, which is needed for "teaching nations" (Mt 28:16-20) and which is also what Mt 5:15 says about the Church.

Because, you said yourself "reborn" have existed all since Pentecost.

However, as you brought up the Final Persecution, I think one of the four leopard heads are going to be Protestants with your attitude to Catholicism. And, as they agree to worship the beast, they will be more pragmatic than you. But they will be like you in the hatred of Catholicism.

@peter zinya To make my point clearer about "pragmatic protestants" and willingness to worship a beast, of the SS, the clear majority were Protestants.