Wednesday, May 19, 2021

Incredulity on Literal Adam and Eve, a Tracing Problem (Quora)

Incredulity on Literal Adam and Eve, a Tracing Problem (Quora) · Tracing Efforts Continue : Given that Trent Session V treats Adam as an individual man, when did modernist Catholics start treating him as just an allegory? · Continuing Sci Debate with Marc Robidoux · Marc and Alex between them · My answer to Marc Robidoux' long comment · Answering Pismenny, More Than One Comment

This begins with someone else answering a question. And me then interacting with him and also with the one posing the question. Michael Anglemyer and Eric Luxner, here we go:

Submission accepted by
Alex Pismenny:

Michael Anglemyer
Former Intelligence Analyst at 3rd Infantry Division
Which scriptures confirm that Adam and Eve were or will be thrown in hell because they were the first humans to disobey God?

Adam and Eve are generally understood as allegorical, but even if Genesis is to be interpreted in a strictly literal sense, scriptures indicate they were remorseful for their disobedience. There would be no reason to presume God’s punishment. In fact, we don’t know that anyone is in Hell, with the exception of Judas Iscariot, whom Jesus said it would have been better if he had not been born. He betrayed the trust of his friends, he knew Jesus first hand, but still rejected Him and despaired of God’s forgiveness.


Hans-Georg Lundahl
18h ago
“Adam and Eve are generally understood as allegorical,”

Since when?

Michael Anglemyer
12h ago
Possibly since the Renaissance and Counter Reformation. Definitely since the Enlightenment. When I attended the seminary 35 years ago, we were taught that Genesis was Hebrew literature — inspired literature. It was not a history book. It used allegory and near eastern tropes to impart certain important truths. The narrative of events is not meant to be interpreted literally; however, it is not a mere fable. There are doctrinal truths contained in the text, such as God created man, creation is inherently good, and sin entered the world as a result of man’s failings.

Hans-Georg Lundahl
6m ago
“Possibly since the Renaissance and Counter Reformation.”

Definitely not.

“Definitely since the Enlightenment.”

Not among Roman Catholic actual believers.

“When I attended the seminary 35 years ago, we were taught that Genesis was Hebrew literature — inspired literature. It was not a history book.”

35 years ago sounds reasonable. Especially in the territory of USCCB or whatever your bishops’ conference is abbreviated.

Thank you for answer, anyway.


Eric Luxner
I’m interested in the idea that Hell will be the end of those who do not follow Jesus. I mean that they will cease to exist. John 3:16 says, For God so Loved the world that he gave His only begotten Son that those who believe in Him will not perish (cease to exist being my interpretation), but have eternal Life. This not a Roman Catholic idea, as I understand, but there are plenty of Scriptures that support it.

That being said, my answer does not directly answer the question, as obviously Adam and Eve were not aware of Jesus. Yet, Jesus was present at the creation and eternally before. In the beginning (of creation, being my interpretation) was the Word.

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”

John‬ 1:1‬ KJV‬‬

Hans-Georg Lundahl
3m ago
In fact, Adam and Eve were very much aware of Jesus as God, it was He who talked to them, and since hearing Him adress the serpent, also of the upcoming Saviour.

And they had 930 years after that to make penance for their disobedience.

However, if they hadn’t repented, they would have been damned, but on the contrary, Catholic and Orthodox iconography portrays them as first of the saved when Jesus descends to Sheol, as He greets His ultimate parents, 72 generations back.

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