Wednesday, September 13, 2017

Two Takes on Susan, My Takes on Them

Two Takes on Susan, My Takes on Them · On Susan's Bow

One youtube comment of mine is now interwoven with some debate*, but I still do comments which just remain my comments without answers too, and as often in such cases, I indicate time signatures:

Susan's Shocking Fate in the Final Chronicle of Narnia (Spoilers)
Glumpuddle, Ajoutée le 16 mars 2016

0:39 No, Susan did NOT die.

[I took his "everyone dies" too literally.]

0:55 From her siblings (the three we know of, but I suppose they were and remained four).

Not necessarily from her parents.

1:09 I agree with the article.

She must, after train crash, have come around.

How I resolve this with Polly's prediction? It was an estimate just after Polly had died, before she had spoken to Aslan.

ALSO - who is telling us in this world about LB? Everyone in it died, so it is not Eustace or Jill. Obvious solution referred to in my chapter "Susan's dreams become a book". She is dreaming true dreams about it.

How does she know the dreams are true?

She dreamed sufficiently of Rilian to see Silver Chair (she had not bothered to hear Eustace and Jill on Narnian matters while they were alive) as a confirmation her dreams were reliable. She is of course reading all of the seven chronicles as they come out, and she was obviously (as still having the maiden name Pevensie and very afraid of getting attended by shrinks for believing in Narnia if she did) very shy before appearance of LWW, just one year or so after train crash (though CSL had obviously asked her permission to publish it).

This means, the words by Polly are known to us, because Susan saw this in the very first dream - the night of the train crash or just before the train crash. So, she was meant to hear Polly's words in that dream in order to be corrected.

Now, what do you think about the view in the article?

1:56 I sense a conflict with my scenario of Susan having Jill as archery pupil ... unless the exclusive interest comes just the last period they knew each other, so Jill could notice (as well as Polly).

Or unless the interest is not too absorbing for her to do some good work, like teaching archery (I'm making her a sports' teacher by profession, at least after publicity - same firm as in Murder Must Advertise or Dorothy Sayer's own pro experience - comes as too shallow after the grief of a train crash).

2:17 As said, Polly is not saying this after the Beatific vision, after meeting Aslan, she is saying this during what CSL considered "the great conversation" ... and we only know Polly's words through Susan's dreams, if this had been a factual story, since CSL's inventions would not be a fact source for it in that case.

4:14 Lewis obviously wanted it ambiguous ... well, I'm in for making her eventual salvation fairly ambiguous to herself too.

But one of CSL's intentions was actually to leave loose ends (Swanwhite is another one, which has been extraordinarily well treated by another fan fic writer - you know the story where the "Adam's flesh and Adam's bone" prophecy is spoken by Swanwhite as she is dying from a snake bite in front of Jadis) in order to encourage fan fic.

He specifically said so in Letters to Children on at least one occasion when asked what happened to this or that character and he asked "why don't you make a story of it?"

4:55 Are you suggesting a scenario in which Lucy of dedication is a standin for Susan or perhaps her real name?

In my fan fic, I have not yet written the chapter thereon, but I intend to let Lucy and perhaps Susan too meet Lucy Barfield, historically correct person in getting the dedication.

5:26 Is Superman your fav?

Mine is actually Captain Marvel - from that small comics company which was eventually bought up by DC after they had sued it over plagiarism.

My fav comics are:

  • the one where Captn Marvel has to deal with LOTS of custard simply floating over
  • the one in which one character is sprayed with a "charm spray" (which hadn't worked on another character, the crook)
  • with Mary Marvel, the one in which a club house is disinfested of fake ghosts (done with phosphorus)
  • with Captain Marvel Jr, the one in which a city resurrects like once every thousand years, and he averts its sultan or whatever from becoming a world dictator.

Compared to that, well, OK, some Superboy ones are quite OK : like when Superboy's dog has to deal with Mxyzsptlck from another dimension.

Will Susan of Narnia Be Saved? A Response to Glumpuddle
Brett Fawcett, Ajoutée le 17 mars 2016

1:43 Back to Narnia physically?

Excluded by Aslan's words at end of PC.

Back to believing in Narnia?

Since LWW, her Christian piety is so interwoven with Stone Table, that if she ever is saved, she arguably won't continue to be a Narnia denier either.

In fact, in my fan fic, I made her impossibility of continuing to deny Narnia an important part of her conversion.

3:17 I have two solutions to this one.

  • 1) already adressed : in England she is adressed as Queen of Fairy Land (she might also be eligible as Queen of Telmarines, if she gets to their Island - I've even thought about making her successor to Pippi Longstocking, making that Southsea island the Telmarine Island**);
  • 2) not yet decided (therefore not adressed in any chapters I wrote): she might as "another person" (wife, widow) return to Narnia on a previous occasion to that of Aslan telling her she will never come back ... as queen Swanwhite.

Probably not the second, unless the word used is "never more", in which case the era of Swanwhite being previous is not a problem ... or is it?

5:47 Speaking of confession.

Yes, in my fan fic, Susan does convert. She also makes a good first confession and communion. In Narnia - Italy.

Back in England, her second Catholic priest is a disaster.

Since he does not believe in Narnia, he does not believe in her culpability against Lucy either and therefore she is unable to confess a real culpability which nevertheless she is really guilty of. So, to avoid invalid confessions, she confesses no more, falls back into doubts about Narnia (and Christianity) even, and can't confess until years later Father Brown comes in making a somewhat better show, towards the end of my novel (lots of chapters remain to be written between the beginning and this).

6:10 I don't know when exactly CSL started going to Anglican (and therefore invalid) confessions ... but he did.

Obviously, you gave a hint about CSL's possible reasons to be vague - if the story had happened.

What if he considered the matter in some fashion as "sub rosa"?

That said, I should perhaps, as I mentioned my fan fic under both videos, give a link to the main index. If you read chapters in order, even with some still missing, at least up to when she shoots arrows at corrupt policemen it is fairly intelligible.

Chronicle of Susan Pevensie


* This was the original main format of this blog.

** The first fan fic I tried to write, on paper, not internet, was when I had been teaching Swedish, and my successor as Swedish teacher showed me an assignment on writing about Pippi Longstocking as grown up. I had her defend the island against Communist forces, and not getting what "fascists" means (any more than King Caspian would understand "fascists, bullies" at the end of The Silver Chair).

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