Friday, February 7, 2020

IV : Epilogue

With Ignatius of Antioch and Ron Aller : I : Before I Get In & My First Response · II : Two Days Ago / One Day Ago · III : Less than One Day Ago · IV : Epilogue

@Hans-Georg Lundahl young earth creationism comes from Ellen G white and she stated all the specific claims of young earth creationism like Noah's flood being the cause of the grand canyon..

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone There were Catholic priests considering Noah's Flood as cause of Paris basin before Ellen G White.

Thanks for showing off your half learning in history, how about getting a bit more all sided in historic lore?

@Hans-Georg Lundahl well they're wrong on the interpretation of the literal understanding of Genesis. There is no such thing as darkness being good or the earth being in vain from the beginning.

I'm a gap creationist I dont believe in evidences for a young earth since it clearly is restored in six numerous contradictions with the young earth interpretation.

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone Gap Creationism exists in the Catholic Church, but only from 1830.

Here is the reference from which I have the tenants of each position:

// La p. (ou colonne?) 2341 et l'article Hexaméron, dans Dictionnaire de Théologie Catholique, VI-II, Ghezzi - Hizler, 1920 (un des éditeurs, Mangenot, était aussi l'auteur de l'article). //

Cited here:

Φιλολoγικά/Philologica : Les Prédécesseurs catholiques de Henry Morris (jusqu'à 1920)

Same article states that the position of Bosizio and others was the default prior to Lyell's research into the geology of the Paris basin and related "deep time" geology.

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone "There is no such thing as darkness being good"

Darkness is not per se created. It is lack of light which is created (and a created image of uncreated light, i e God) and for which other things were created.

So, darkness being there does not rule out that everything created was very good.

@Hans-Georg Lundahl like what other things were created in the 6 day account?. It clearly is already there from things already water earth etc..darkness was upon the face of the earth I think it was...

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone Some things were created ex nihilo, some made from what was there.

Darkness is not "created" since it is not a thing.

@Hans-Georg Lundahl yes but my point was it covers the earth something God didnt create ....obviously the Light is Good and that is how the creation must begin with things He actually created...which is what is actually good...darkness and the condition of the earth isnt called good until it is restored by God within 6 days. I dont know why young earth creationist dont see the problem with their literal interpretation of Genesis.

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone Heaven and earth are created. Until visible (created) light is also created, that is darkness, not because God created darkness, but when creating heaven and earth did not yet create light.

"I dont know why young earth creationist dont see the problem with their literal interpretation of Genesis."

Like it's the one of St. Thomas and the majority of Church Fathers (except one moment creationists like St. Augustine and one or two more)?

Besides, one moment creationists also don't seem to have any use for gap theory?

@Hans-Georg Lundahl well it actually would benefit many creationists to adapt the gap theory it would solve alot of inconsistencies..

Hans-Georg Lundahl
Like, which ones?

@Hans-Georg Lundahl like the one I must pointed out...young earthers say it is good in the beginning yet apparently not since the earth is covered in darkness and without form and void ..God never calls it why do young earthers call it good?

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone The darkness was not meant to last and the world with which darkness was, was still a good world, and ... what God finally calls good is the light, see here:

[1] In the beginning God created heaven, and earth. [2] And the earth was void and empty, and darkness was upon the face of the deep; and the spirit of God moved over the waters. [3] And God said: Be light made. And light was made. [4] And God saw the light that it was good; and he divided the light from the darkness. [5] And he called the light Day, and the darkness Night; and there was evening and morning one day. [Genesis 1, obviously]

@Hans-Georg Lundahl the darkness is not how God created the earth is what you dont seem to understand.

Isaiah 45:18
For thus says the LORD, Who created the heavens, Who is God, Who formed the earth and made it, Who has established it, Who did not create it in vain, Who formed it to be inhabited: “I am the LORD, and there is no other

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone In order for earth to be inhabited, it needs cycles of dark and light, so if the darkness lasted no longer than one night (12 hours) there is nothing about it (earth before light) which is not good.

@Hans-Georg Lundahl that's not what the word darkness means ...its associated with evil and the light is associated with Christ who comes into the world...the condition of the earth is certainly not good since it parallels Noah's ark the earth covered in water. It's clear signs of Divine Judgement upon the earth

Jeremiah 4:23
I looked on the earth, and behold, it was without form and void; and to the heavens, and they had no light

Matthew 24:29
Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.

Genesis 1:2
The earth was without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.

Ezekiel 32:7-8
When I blot you out, I will cover the heavens and make their stars dark; I will cover the sun with a cloud, and the moon shall not give its light. All the bright lights of heaven will I make dark over you, and put darkness on your land, declares the Lord God

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@matrixlone A darkened sun as in one of the passages you provide, over living creatures who need light, not 24/24, but around 12/24, is not a fair parallel to the darkness here talked about.

It doesn't say "God had judged" it says and the spirit of God moved over the waters.

Meaning, while there was room for improvement, very promptly upcoming, the first condition was not bad.

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