Wednesday, March 27, 2024

Why Don't I Share Lutheran Admiration for Luther?

One could argue, even if Luther had been right, back in 1517, in fact he wasn't, there is still no use in trying to uphold his 95 theses, since NOBODY does.

The Catholics follow a Pope who condemned 41 theses (not all of them from the 1517 document, some from earlier works).

The Lutherans, at best, follow his later lines (though that would involve huge amounts of Antisemitism, once again underlining what Chesterton said about Luther being a precursor to Hitler), and at worst a totally made up pseudo-history of his life, which would be inspired by what non-Lutherans wrote much later. I cannot pinpoint Merle d'Aubigné in this case, which I know to be a fact about the founders of 7 Day Adventism, but I can say what this Lutheran pretends is total bogus:

Why Did The Catholic Martin Luther Leave The Church?
CTKLM | 2 Nov. 2022

0:51 "the belief that a believer could buy an indulgence"

Can you document that as being a belief which was around for Luther to criticise?

Indulgences were given for good works, and then and there certain types of alms were among these, does not mean anyone said indulgences could be bought.

1:02 I just checked wikisource.

In the 95 thesis, there is no contestation against Purgatory existing, and there is no pretense that the Purgatory is not mentioned in Scripture.

One part of contestation was this passage, theses 16 through 20:

16. Hell, purgatory, and heaven seem to differ as do despair, almost-despair, and the assurance of safety.
17. With souls in purgatory it seems necessary that horror should grow less and love increase.
18. It seems unproved, either by reason or Scripture, that they are outside the state of merit, that is to say, of increasing love.
19. Again, it seems unproved that they, or at least that all of them, are certain or assured of their own blessedness, though we may be quite certain of it.
20. Therefore by "full remission of all penalties" the pope means not actually "of all," but only of those imposed by himself.
21. Therefore those preachers of indulgences are in error, who say that by the pope's indulgences a man is freed from every penalty, and saved;
22. Whereas he remits to souls in purgatory no penalty which, according to the canons, they would have had to pay in this life.

As you can see, Luther presumes 1) there are souls in Purgatory, 2) as they can still continue sanctification, they should not want to get time off from it, 3) a contestation of what the Church can or cannot remit by an Indulgence.

1:17 What was Luther saying in 1517, on works?

41. Apostolic[70] pardons are to be preached with caution, lest the people may falsely think them preferable to other good works of love.
42. Christians are to be taught that the pope does not intend the buying of pardons to be compared in any way to works of mercy.
43. Christians are to be taught that he who gives to the poor or lends to the needy does a better work than buying pardons;
44. Because love grows by works of love, and man becomes better; but by pardons man does not grow better, only more free from penalty.

1:50 In 1517, Luther was not the least pretending Purgatory, Good Works or even Indulgences were leading people to Hell.

2:33 to 2:37 ... Why did you leave out Ephesians 2:10?

So, not by works (already done before justification), but certainly into works (those that God has prepared for us).

I think a better translation would be "of" or "from", so I give the full quote from Ephesians 2 in Latin Vulgate and English Douay Rheims:

8 Gratia enim estis salvati per fidem, et hoc non ex vobis : Dei enim donum est : 9 non ex operibus, ut ne quis glorietur. 10 Ipsius enim sumus factura, creati in Christo Jesu in operibus bonis, quae praeparavit Deus ut in illis ambulemus.

8 For by grace you are saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, for it is the gift of God; 9 Not of works, that no man may glory. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus in good works, which God hath prepared that we should walk in them.

2:55 "the Church had put a bounty on his head, that if anyone killed him"

Can you document that?

Or are you informing yourself on Luther by Merle d'Aubigné, who should have been a novelist rather than a pastor?

Are you a direct descendant of Grigori Rasputin?

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@brandenburg2388 Are you part of "Christ the King Lutheran Ministries"?

If not, why are they not answering, but leaving a kind of ad hominem to "people" (if that's even the word) like you?

@hglundahl I'm just curious because you look so much like Rasputin from your hairstyle and beard.

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@brandenburg2388 Hairstyle and beard are very non-genetic things.

OK, women don't have beards, and some people are genetically bald, but otherwise ...

Jude Enweremadu
These guys love to spread falsehood against the Holy Roman Catholic church

Hans-Georg Lundahl
@judeenweremadu609 Indeed!

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