Let's Hope Alicia Hernandez is Not Around Where I Am

Assorted Retorts: Rise of Loneliness · Mormons and Muslims Have Similarities · Yes, Christianity Traditionally Permits 12 Year Old Women to Marry — No, Not Three Year Old Girls · Let's Hope Alicia Hernandez is Not Around Where I Am · Brett, Formerly Miss Cooper, Had Some Things to Say · New blog on the kid: Japan Went the Wrong Way

Nikstar1313

@nikstar1313

@hglundahl 14 yo is a child

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@hglundahl

@nikstar1313 No.

Alicia Hernandez

@aliciahernandez6203

@willhelmberkly3025 13 year olds cant look more than 16. Still too young. For you to strike up a conversation shows you’re just trying to convince yourself you’re not wrong.

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl so they’re adults?!!! At 14 I was absolutely a child! I had zero interest in having sex with anyone.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 You do you, but I think you overdo the typicality of your own psyche back then.

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl Sir stop justifying your perverseness.

[I think one of mine was deleted here]

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl May God help heal your mind and spirit. This is an abomination. I am disgusted to my core!

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 The truly abominable thing is the brainwashing that a combination of raised marital ages and compulsory mostly school education can effect.

The mother of St. Francis of Sales married at 14. But perhaps you are a Methodist Protestant who would have believed in Eugenics back in the 50's? I'm a Catholic, and I refuse you insulting lots of Catholic marriages, as well as Church discipline.

Plus, when it comes to myself, I'm a virgin, largely because people of your damnable prejudices have been fulfilling St. Paul's prophecy about the entimes in the epistle to Timothy, yes, I recalled correctly, 1st epistle, chapter 4, verse 3. Repent!

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl Sir being a virgin does not speak of your moral character. A 14 year old with another 14 year old is understandable and still not appropriate hence 2 Timothy 2:22.

@hglundahl no one is forbidding you to marry. You just can’t marry underage. The bible also talks about obeying the law Romans 13:1-2

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 "Sir being a virgin does not speak of your moral character."

No, but of my martyrdom. Of the bad moral character of others, whom I identify as agreeing with you.

"A 14 year old with another 14 year old is understandable and still not appropriate hence 2 Timothy 2:22."

But flee thou youthful desires, and pursue justice, faith, charity, and peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

One way of doing that would be to apply I Cor. 7:2. Which normally, in normal Christian societies can be done at the 14/12 limit.

"no one is forbidding you to marry."

Oh, you are so involved in my situation you can make that hypocritic remark with confidence about pretending to know? Hope not. I am not talking of legal barriers.

"You just can’t marry underage."

No, that's not all what I'm up against. People with YOUR prejudice have been making sure not just 14 year olds, but girls over 18 and 20 have been "protected" against me.

"The bible also talks about obeying the law Romans 13:1-2"

Pope Leo XIII talks of the limits of civil law in Immortale Dei. The civil law has no right to raise marital age so egregiously, Roman law at that time recognised a 14 year old man and a 12 year old woman could marry.

But apart from that, no, I am NOT just up against legal barriers, I am NOT exclusively into underage, and therefore the fact of NOT having been able to either find some girl over 18 (limit here in France) or wait till so and so was 18 says sth about people going way beyond the law to pander to your modernist and heretical prejudice.

The law can decree, at the utmost, a waiting period, it can't decree that someone is a pervert for wanting what was in Christian centuries perfectly licit and also actually done.

The perversion, notably of sexual morality, is on your side.

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl Your arguments support the word of man versus the word of God. I honor and uphold the bible as the only truth.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 Oh, since you had a Spanish name, I presumed you were Catholic!

For Bible, what about telling me, where the age limits are set out?

For man's word, why is Rome and the Catholic world and centuries of Christians worse than progressive era US?

For the Bible again, what about this?

Let no man, when he is tempted, say that he is tempted by God. For God is not a tempter of evils, and he tempteth no man.
[James 1:13]

Given the temptations of adolescence, from puberty on, this would simply not been true if God had made it impossible to give valid consent to marriage for most who start having sexual desires. So, the higher age limits are not the law of God, but of evil men. You yourself quoted a verse which, taken with I Cor 7:2, highly suggests that teens who can't be chaste should marry!

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl sir you believe what you want but you must obey the law whether you agree with it or not. I am a God follower and abode only by His word.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 My enemies have not followed laws about calumny or harrassment or so on when trying to protect girls that maybe didn't need all that much protection.

You side with them, you are not a God follower in my book.

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl Jesus loves you and wants the chains of blaming, trauma, frustration, and lust to be broken in you so you may live in true freedom of the spirit. I pray one day soon you find freedom from lust and can experience the true beauty of singlehood like our Lord Jesus Christ did. Children dont want you. Please court women older than 18. Preferably around your own age that will have the maturity to hell guide you and teach you about true companionship. Not all is lost if you surrender to Jesus all of your worldly desires. I dont know how you fell into this trap but dont let the enemy win. Sir it is wrong to pursue and lust anyone under 18. Children obtain serious trauma from this. Please help yourself. You are responsible for you. God bless.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 Why do you presume I am a very lustful person?

@aliciahernandez6203 "Children obtain serious trauma from this."

1) Why do you presume I am pursuing someone under 18?
2) Why do you presume trauma for those under 18 comes from the pursuit rather than from overreactions from the "adult world" that stop things from going the way of a future marriage?

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl You have repeated over and over how you think 14 year olds should be able to be married and that’s prevented you from being in a romantic relationship . You also assumed I was Catholic.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 "how you think 14 year olds should be able to be married and that’s prevented you from being in a romantic relationship"

People like you have indeed overreacted like you.

This does not mean what you think it means.

You have not answered about Scripture. You pretend it trumps Catholic precedent (which was also Protestant precedent), you do not show it trumps prejudice of the psychological professionals. To you that is. To me, it obviously does.

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl scripture does not state an age of marriage. Left it up to government. Not you sir.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 "Left it up to government."

The one government we are directly required to respect is the Roman one.

Age limit 14 for men, 12 for women, from Caesar Augustus to when Austria started Enlightenment, and even then a 14 year old girl could marry with parental consent up to the end of the Empire.

THAT'S government I respect.

Some other government is also mentioned in the Bible. Apocalypse 13.

Alicia Hernandez

@hglundahl were not under the Roman empire. Your reality is not the reality. Just say thats what you want and stop making ridiculous excuses or explanations for it. It doesn’t make sense to anyone but you. Please just keep leaning into Christ. Ask Him what He wants for you. If you need help from a professional thats ok. We all do sometimes.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@aliciahernandez6203 "were not under the Roman empire"

That MIGHT mean we are already under the other empire, that mentioned not in Romans 13 but in Apocalypse 13, and which we are not called to obey?

"Just say thats what you want and stop making ridiculous excuses or explanations for it."

I am actually arguing a principled RIGHT, and one that modern governments are violating. What I want for myself right now is simply not the point.

"We all do sometimes."

Oh, you consider Catholic priests unwanted in a Christian life, but therapists are quite OK?

I don't think so, and especially not in a context when it's offered in order to problematise what is not a problem.

Ronald Mcnerney jr

@ronaldmcnerneyjr3467

@hglundahl
Are you fu*** series?

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@ronaldmcnerneyjr3467 Yes.

Penney Bayer

@pbayer773

@hglundahl 14 is still a child

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@pbayer773 No.

Not yet major, still minor, shouldn't run an own business without parental supervision, but definitely has come to puberty and is therefore no longer a child.

Could physically speaking marry, has been legally able to marry, still is in some states, and therefore should be legally able to marry again.

dreamboat annie

@user-vs3fm3ww1q

@hglundahl are you serious? A 14 year old is still a child. Some kids don’t even start puberty until 14 or 15….

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@user-vs3fm3ww1q The medium age of puberty is some months over 12 for girls, some months over 14 for boys.

The typical range is between 11th and 14th birthdays for girls and 13th and 16th birthdays for boys.

J

@Jrod110

The Bible says it is better for those who hard children to self delete.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@Jrod110 Actually not. Jesus doesn't say to execute themselves, but to be executed.

Also not "hurt" just in any way shape or form, but scandalise.

Also, he was not speaking about teens already having reached puberty.

[But he that shall scandalize one of these little ones that believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone should be hanged about his neck, and that he should be drowned in the depth of the sea.
[Matthew 18:6]]

JB

@YaMother001

@hglundahl you make a lot of comments about young girls and how they are fertile at age 12. There is something very wrong with you.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@YaMother001 I make a lot of responses to people like you. Who have started to focus on me for some quirky reason.

@YaMother001 As I copy the exchange, I find yours is another empty channel, how many others coincide with yours in that respect, and how many of them are actually by the same person?

JB

@hglundahl you aren’t that important my guy.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@YaMother001 Apparently so far yes, I have had backfire from your type just on this thread for two weeks to a month, plus lots of other attempts to gaslight me ...

JB

@hglundahl it’s not backfire, love, it’s simply people expressing their opinions about the opinions you expressed. If it hurts your feelings this much, maybe the internets aren’t for you…

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@YaMother001 I didn't say it hurt my feelings.

I classified their opinions as flaming.

LOTS of people would love to get me off the internet, and your comment could in certain contexts be made to serve that purpose.

David Hall

@davidhall5280

@hglundahl you need to go to jail.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@davidhall5280 Me? Why?

Because I disagree with you?

JTM7clan

@jtm7clan277

@hglundahl umm..eww. If a 20 year old asked to date my 14 year old “under supervision” it would be a hell no.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@jtm7clan277 I think I'll pass on your 14 year old then, thanks for the info.

Meanwhile, should she feel somewhat cramped, you are sending her off to confront real and dishonest groomers, who don't think about marriage.

Think about that for a bit.

JTM7clan

@hglundahl nope, not sending her into that at all. Open communication and trust has formed a bond in which she can always talk to us. Parental guidance is a seemingly lost art these days. Teaching her the warning signs of groomer activity is also important. I don’t care how you are, most 20 year old males are thinking about 1 thing in a relationship, and I highly doubt they’d want to wait 4 years to get laid. So, yeah-20 year olds looking at 14 year olds to marry and pro-create with is not okay.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@jtm7clan277 "in which she can always talk to us."

As long as that is sufficient for her.

JTM7clan

@hglundahl when she’s an adult, she can make those adult decisions. As a 14 year old, absolutely not. Have you been around many 14 year olds? I know you like to mention times past, but life expectancy was like 40 then too, so-times are not the same.

Curious, you believe 20 and 14 is okay. Where do you draw the line age wise? Is 55 and 14 okay in your view?

@hglundahl also, Talitha was 12 years old in the Bible and Jesus called her “little girl”.

“Then He took the child by the hand, and said to her, “Talitha, cumi,” which is translated, “Little girl, I say to you, arise.” Immediately the girl arose and walked, for she was twelve years of age. And they were overcome with great amazement.” ‭‭
Mark‬ ‭5‬:‭41‬-‭42‬ ‭

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@jtm7clan277 1) You are wrong on life expectancy, unless you mean life expectancy at birth, and sometimes for women too. I have seen samples where life expectancy for women who were married was c. 55 or more.
2) I believe there are minimal ages, not maximal age limits.
3) As 12 is on the edge, it is possible the girl had not yet entered puberty, it is also possible that korasion and by implication talitha don't actually mean "little" as in "child", however she is called "paidion" ...
4) "when she's an adult" ... some people are forced to grow up because of their desires, and this is not foreseeable nor a matter of simply discipline
5) so many things are supposed to happen these days before one is an adult — in some cases, some stay unmarried to 29 and then complain about it. ‭‭
‭‭

JTM7clan

@hglundahl in the 1800s the average life expectancy was 45. Your use of paidion here doesn’t really matter because that word is still referring to a child. ‭‭
‭‭
Just because someone remains unmarried by 29 and complains doesn’t mean we should start allowing children to get married (and yes, 14 is a child). As I said, I have a 14 year old, and a 13 year old. They are not ready for adult life and all that comes with it. I would not want our children being raised by children or our economy being ran by 14 and 15 year olds. The fact that you think a 12 year old and a 55 year old can be married is apphorent, frankly. ‭‭
‭‭

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@jtm7clan277 "in the 1800s the average life expectancy was 45." ‭‭
‭‭
What country? ‭‭
‭‭
"that word is still referring to a child" ‭‭
‭‭
Apparently not all contexts, no. The Latin has puella which does not imply childhood. ‭‭
‭‭
"Just because someone remains unmarried by 29 and complains doesn’t mean we should start allowing children to get married (and yes, 14 is a child)." ‭‭
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It's not. ‭‭
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"As I said, I have a 14 year old, and a 13 year old. They are not ready for adult life and all that comes with it." ‭‭
‭‭
You count on female co-breadwinners? ‭‭
‭‭
"I would not want our children being raised by children" ‭‭
‭‭
If God has made a person capable of bearing children, He has also made her capable of raising them. Even if a stay at home mum doesn't suit your feminism. ‭‭
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"or our economy being ran by 14 and 15 year olds." ‭‭
‭‭
I actually agree. Men as breadwinners usually need to be older than teens, and I wouldn't want a 14 to 16 year old boy to sign contracts without parental consent. The marital contract excepted. ‭‭
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"The fact that you think a 12 year old and a 55 year old can be married is apphorent, frankly." ‭‭
‭‭
Feel as you like. It's not a warrant for putting me in prison. ‭‭
‭‭
Here are some statistics for known persons, Middle Ages. Female only, age at first marriage and at death. ‭‭
‭‭
Matilda of Flanders ‭‭
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matilda_of_Flanders ‭‭
‭‭
Constance (c.1062 – 1090), married Alan IV Fergent, Duke of Brittany. ‭‭
Adela, (c.1067 – 1137), married Stephen, Count of Blois. Mother of King Stephen of England. ‭‭
‭‭
Eleanor of Champagne / of Blois ‭‭
‭‭
Eleanor of Aquitaine ‭‭
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eleanor_of_Aquitaine ‭‭
‭‭
Marie of France, Countess of Champagne ‭‭
Alice of France ‭‭
Matilda of England, Duchess of Saxony ‭‭
Eleanor of England, Queen of Castile ‭‭
Joan of England, Queen of Sicily ‭‭
‭‭
Marie of Champagne ‭‭
‭‭
Margaret, Countess of Blois ‭‭
Isabelle of Chartres ‭‭
‭‭
Matilda or Richenza of Saxony ‭‭
‭‭
Berengaria of Castile ‭‭
Urraca of Castile, Queen of Portugal ‭‭
Blanche of Castile ‭‭
‭‭
Joan, Countess of Flanders ‭‭
Margaret II, Countess of Flanders ‭‭
‭‭
Beatrice II, Countess of Burgundy ‭‭
Mary, Countess of Blois ‭‭
‭‭
Matilda of Amboise ‭‭
‭‭
Berengaria of León ‭‭
‭‭
Eleanor of Portugal, Queen of Denmark ‭‭
‭‭
Joan of Dampierre ‭‭
‭‭
Agnes of Merania ‭‭
Beatrix of Andechs-Merania ‭‭
Adelaide, Countess of Burgundy (lacks birthyear) ‭‭
‭‭
Marie of Brienne ‭‭
‭‭
Sophie, married in 1259 to Count Henry VIII of Weida (c. 1238 – 17 September 1280) ‭‭
‭‭
20 21 30 33 33 33 33 34 37 38 41 42 45 45 47 48 51 52 53 53 ‭‭
19 19 28 30 32 32 33 33 36 37 40 42 44 45 46 47 51 52 52 53 ‭‭
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
‭‭
56 60 61 64 67 70 71 79 82 ‭‭
55 59 60 64 66 69 67 77 79 ‭‭
21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 ‭‭
‭‭
20 34 47 60 82 ‭‭
19 33 46 59 79 ‭‭
01 08 15 22 29 ‭‭
‭‭
09 10 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13 14 14 14 14 15 15 17 17 18 18 19 19 20 20 21 26 29 ‭‭
09 10 10 10 11 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13 13 13 14 14 16 16 17 18 19 20 20 20 25 26 ‭‭
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 ‭‭
‭‭
09 12:12 14 18:19 29 ‭‭
09 11:11 13 17:18 26 ‭‭
01 07:08 14 20:21 27 ‭‭
‭‭
So, on these samples, median lifespan for a woman was 46 to 47 (sources are not totally in agreement or precise on all). The median age at first marriage (two of these lack the year, while one lacks birthyear) 13 to 14. ‭‭
‭‭

JTM7clan

@hglundahl So, some people complain that they don’t have it together by 29 and your solution is to marry them off at 12. ?? Where’s the logic in that? 12 year olds are children. They have little to no life experience. Life expectancy in the 1800s was 45 if you were lucky. The idea that you’re okay with a 20-30-40-50 year old marrying a 12-13 year old is abhorrent. Curious, how old are you? ‭‭
‭‭

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@jtm7clan277 "So, some people complain that they don’t have it together by 29 and your solution is to marry them off at 12. ??" ‭‭
‭‭
Did I mention "marry off"? I do not believe in forced marriage, as to arranging marriages, fine enough if a child asks for it ... ‭‭
‭‭
"Where’s the logic in that?" ‭‭
‭‭
Where does a strawman leave logic? ‭‭
‭‭
But more seriously than your style of questioning deserves: when parents and teachers want to keep teen girls in school and to that purpose delay marriage and delay affairs (btw, I'd agree teen girls shouldn't have premarital affairs, no one should), the top notch argument is "develop yourself, get a life first" ... precisely what a certain 29 year old girl actually did. Brett Cooper (by now an artist's name, she's married, good for her) pointed out that fitting someone into a life already highly defined is less easy than a couple defining their life together. ‭‭
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"12 year olds are children." ‭‭
‭‭
12 year old boys pretty certainly are. Girls, not so certain. Get a grip on gynaecology. ‭‭
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"They have little to no life experience." ‭‭
‭‭
In some decisions we certainly DO need experience. Hence, I would not have teens running their business without parental supervision. ‭‭
‭‭
In some decisions, it's a matter of taste. Chosing someone to live with mainly is that. Hence, less life experience is needed. ‭‭
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"Life expectancy in the 1800s was 45 if you were lucky." ‭‭
‭‭
1) Thanks for the phoney and undocumented demographics. ‭‭
‭‭2) And for totally missing the point that the Middle Ages are more my go to than 1800's, even if I actually gave precisely Medieval stats. ‭‭
‭‭
"The idea that you’re okay with a 20-30-40-50 year old marrying a 12-13 year old is abhorrent." ‭‭
‭‭
Thanks for voicing your opinion, but don't destroy peoples' lives about it! ‭‭
‭‭
"Curious, how old are you?" ‭‭
‭‭
Too old not to want a younger wife, since I hope for a family, not just a partner in bed and over candle dinners. ‭‭
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Also too old not to be somewhat suspicious if person A disappears on a topic and person B (if truly other) bumps in. ‭‭
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Were you hinting at my love interest being 12? I don't think she is ... ‭‭
‭‭

Beckie Whittle

@beckiewhittle7703

@hglundahl what age is a adult? ‭‭
‭‭

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@beckiewhittle7703 Depends on what purpose. ‭‭
‭‭
Adult enough to rule a community? 30. You can't be a bishop before 30. ‭‭
‭‭
Adult enough to run a business (without parental supervision), I'd say 25, but it's lowered to 18. ‭‭
‭‭
Adult enough to marry? ‭‭
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Medium age of puberty. 14 / 12. Unfortunately raised to 18. ‭‭
‭‭
If you disagree more than marginally (the Catholic Church has disagreed marginally in practise, rasing it to 16 / 14 = 95 % in puberty), that means you think God made a mismatch between onset of certain desires (not necessarily linked to directly imagining a coitus, but they would lead to one if successfully acted on for some time), and the capacity to consent. Meaning to a lifelong relation. ‭‭
‭‭
I refuse to blaspheme God, I prefer to blame modern society, which has this 18/18 rule, fortunately not everywhere. ‭‭
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Beckie Whittle

@hglundahl interesting beliefs. Do you have se*ual thoughts about people under the age of 18? ‭‭
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Hans-Georg Lundahl

Why do you wonder? ‭‭
‭‭

No

answer. ‭‭
‭‭

Hans-Georg Lundahl

@beckiewhittle7703 Are you trying to foment some hysteria about me? ‭‭
‭‭
I am in France. You are in an English speaking country. I presume at least. Could you leave me to the French, or do you have to impose US American prejudice on my situation in France? ‭‭
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Some in the block where I am have English speaking connexions. Some are also highly into hysteria about me. Could there be some connexion, through people like you? ‭‭
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Beckie Whittle

@hglundahl I’m not from America either. But if you need help I’m sure there are services in France that can help you don’t be afraid to speak to someone with what you’re dealing with ‭‭
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Hans-Georg Lundahl

@beckiewhittle7703 I didn't say you were from US. Your prejudice against age gaps and teen marriages is. ‭‭
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I am dealing with people trying to import that prejudice full on into France. Not with "issues" ... unless it's their ones. ‭‭
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Beckie Whittle

@hglundahl I don’t have any problem with ages gaps as long as both adults are happy ‭‭
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Hans-Georg Lundahl

@beckiewhittle7703 Me neither. ‭‭
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Adult defined as per previous. ‭‭
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Beckie Whittle

@hglundahl an adult is someone over the age of 18 why your choosing to put so much energy into justifying the sexualisation of children is really creepy. But I don’t need to give you a hard time about it, I imagine having to live you’re life is lonely and hard enough ‭‭
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Hans-Georg Lundahl

@beckiewhittle7703 I recall what I was at age 14. ‭‭
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Not 18. Also not asexual. ‭‭
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I have had two pupils in a couple, hoped to see them married, people agreeing with you made sure they went on their own respective personal developments instead. ‭‭
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I have had another pupil who had had abortions by age 13. ‭‭
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I could have lived a happier life, and so could the couple, if your ideology hadn't been around. The pregnant girl could have kept her baby or babies if she had been able to marry the father. ‭‭
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P L U S your ideology, going back to Progressive Era United States, is a blatant insult to our ancestors. P L U S, I am simply answering person after person who tried to find fault with me, first several others, then Alicia Fernandez, then JTM7clan, now you. ‭‭
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YOUR criterium for me not spending lots of energy on the question would obviously be for me to get hiding and hand over the thread to you or to even cave in to your pressure. No thanks, at least for the latter. ‭‭
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Beckie Whittle

@hglundahl You’re naive to think I’ll take ideological advice from someone who’s openly bitter and resentful about their life Find someone legal and build a happy life together ‭‭
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Hans-Georg Lundahl

@beckiewhittle7703 Thanks for the advice. ‭‭
‭‭
Openly resentful about my life is too much to say, but definitely about actions taken by people taking your views in other respects.